Proven Method For Beating Your Competition | Are Niche Websites Worth It? Turning Real Estate Clients Into Personal Lenders | Probate Mastermind Podcast Episode 307

Preview for Probate Mastermind Real Estate Podcast episode 307. Listing and investing with probate leads

Proven Method For Beating Your Competition | Are Niche Websites Worth It? Turning Real Estate Clients Into Personal Lenders | Probate Mastermind Podcast Episode 307

Proven Method For Beating Your Competition | Are Niche Websites Worth It? Turning Clients Into Personal Lenders Probate Mastermind Podcast #307

Probate Mastermind Episode #307 | Recorded Live on December 10th, 2020.  

Join Us Live Every Thursday | Previous Episodes.


Episode Summary: 

In this episode of the Probate Mastermind Podcast:

  • Jim shares how he is winning multiple deals won through attorney referrals
  • Chad advises Fed on building a solid relationship with a fix-and-flipper
  • Joe shares how he is edging out his competition of 15 years in the probate space
  • The mastermind share advice on niche digital marketing, turning probate clients into personal lenders and key SOI referral sources, and how probate can be the perfect niche for new agents and investors.

***Most importantly, we hear more incredible success stories from rookies and veterans that are turning probate leads into listings, acquisitions, and wholesale deals!


These episodes are recorded as a live Question and Answer Mastermind with participation from agents and investors across the country. Thanks for tuning in, and don’t forget to subscribe for future episodes!


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Call Re-cap:

The Best Real Estate Niche For New Agents (1:10)

Cliff is new to real estate and is looking to start working with sellers.  Jim lays out why probate leads are an extremely good niche for new real estate agents who haven’t established their brand in their market quite yet. Also, many experienced traditional agents have certain habits engrained, and learning the All The Leads Probate Approach teaches the right skills, language, and strategies from the start.

See More: The Probate Leads gathered, validated, and skip-traced for you.

Real Estate Loans: Private Money vs Hard Money Real Estate Lenders

Real Estate Loans: Private Money vs Hard Money Real Estate Lenders (2:56)

Chad breaks down the semantics and actual differences between Private and Hard Money loans.

See More: Go Navigator Capital: The Bridge Between Private and Hard Money Real Estate Loans

How Do You Follow Up On Real Estate Leads That Hung Up

How Do You Follow Up On Real Estate Leads That Hung Up (7:46 : 23:21)

Christian is looking for advice on probate prospecting.  When making cold calls, what should you do when the personal representative hangs up on you? Should you always call them back, and how should you follow up with probate leads in the future? Chad also offers advice on changing your USP to fit the context better next call.

Are Niche Websites Worth It For Your Real Estate Business?

Are Niche Websites Worth It For Your Real Estate Business? (10:49)

Caller is interested in a setting up a separate website for the probate side of his real estate business.  The value in having a separate page for this niche is that your USP and branding can present as something much more valuable to a family going through probate than a traditional real estate marketing website.  These websites will establish credibility and trust.  Chad describes the websites.
See More: ATL’s Probate Credibility Website Sample
David Pannell’s Marketing System: Premium Letters (23:21 of this episode)

More on Digital Marketing (Facebook Ads, Videos, Blogging, and more) in the Probate Niche:

  1. Check out the first two segments of Probate Mastermind #288
  2. Article: Ads vs. Organic Marketing: Are Facebook Ads Worth It? Navigating the Digital Marketing World As A Real Estate Agent, Investor, Wholesaler 
  3. How to Use Facebook To Stay Top Of Mind With Leads Stuck In Court Back Logs: Second Segment of Probate Mastermind 283
  4. Probate Mastermind 278
  5. Probate Mastermind 280
  6. Probate Mastermind 281

Proven Method For Beating Your Real Estate Competition

Proven Method For Beating Your Real Estate Competition: (17:47)

Joe shares his journey of entering the probate space, applying the approach he learned from, and beating out his competition as a result. He’s been in competition with one agent in his market for 15 years, and the value-first approach is giving Joe the winning edge. Joe and the masterminds take this success one step further and discuss how to help probate clients turn equity into investments and even become private lenders for future investment deals.  The ultimate way to beat your competition is not just to win deals on a one-by-one basis, but to turn clients into assets in your sphere of influence.

How to Turn Closed Probate Cases Into Real Estate Opportunities

How to Turn Closed Probate Cases Into Real Estate Opportunities (25:19)

Probate leads aren’t dead just because probate court has ended.  In fact, there is actually a significant proportion of leads that still need to sell property and much less competition targeting them with marketing. Caller and the Coaches also discuss how to approach personal representatives who shared an address with the deceased (widows, live-in relatives, etc).

See More: Call a surviving spouse? Tips for prospecting probate leads for real estate (


Recommendations for Real Estate Virtual Assistants

Recommendations for Real Estate Virtual Assistants (31:15)

April is a Virtual Assistant from MyOutDesk working for an subscriber.
See More: Daniel Ramsey - My Out Desk - Hiring a Real Estate Virtual Assistant (

Jim Wins Multiple Deals Through Attorney Networking

Jim Wins Multiple Deals Through Attorney Networking (32:01)

Jim Forsythe is closing on multiple deals: Several are coming from a single attorney! Jim shifted gears towards working with attorneys about two months ago and it’s already paying off big time! Jim and the coaches discuss B2B networking, deal structuring, and marketing strategy.


Building A Strong Relationship With Fix and Flippers

Building A Strong Relationship With Fix and Flippers (39:34)

Fed is working with a newer flipper and is finding himself coaching him quite often.  What should he do to help solidify this relationship and make sure this flipper is evolving efficiently? Chad advises.

Approaching Probate Attorneys Named As The Administrator

Approaching Probate Attorneys Named As The Administrator (46:04)

Giovanni is looking to approach attorneys that hae been appointed administrator for individual probate cases. How should he approach this in a way that gets him through the gatekeeper? Chad advises on language and establishing a long-term relationship over a lead-by-lead relationship.





Looking to hear prospecting tips in action? Check out our live role play series.


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Episode Transcript

Probate Mastermind Real Estate Podcast Episode #307


A.I. Voice Narration: [00:00:00] Welcome to the Probate Mastermind Podcast. These episodes are recorded live once a week and are hosted by the coaches. Agents, investors, and wholesalers join the coaches each week for everything from marketing tips, sales, psychology, live deal analysis, transaction engineering, advanced real estate strategy and personal development.

You will learn to get more listings, more deals and find financial freedom by listening to these episodes. Be sure to catch show notes at and join our free Facebook mastermind community:



Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:00:33] Welcome industrious agents and investors nationwide today is Thursday, December 10th, 2020. And this is mastermind podcast number 307. Coming up on the holidays. Hope you guys are finishing the year strong. We have four in the queue right now. We do have room for more. So just hit star six and, hit one and you can get in there and, Have your questions, your wins, pretty much nothing's out of bounds on this or off limits on these calls.

So let's start with our first caller phone number ending in one, one, one zero. You're up next.

The Best Real Estate Niche for New Agents [00:01:10]Cliff: [00:01:10] Hi, this is Cliff. I'm new to this, and actually I'm new into real estate business. I have my license.  but, yeah, I saw that my wife had gotten a thing a while back.

She's been a realtor for a long time, and I just want to find out how to get involved in this kind of market. cause I would rather deal with,  sellers than buyers.

Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:01:26] Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah.  cliff, this is a, I will just tell you it's an extremely good niche for a brand new agent because. A vast majority of these people you're going to be reaching out to are not local.

You're going to be reaching out to people all over the country that just inherited property in your market. And they don't know you from the guy that's got signs all over the neighborhood are doing, print and TV commercials. So you're really on an equal footing. And sometimes I think you're on a better footing because you're really trained to do probate.

A lot of the experienced traditional agents are set in their ways, so you're what you're really doing. You're reaching out to motivated absentee owners, and helping them,  anything they need, including getting their property listed and sold. But, if you, unless you have any specific questions, I'll do the same thing.

I'll have one of our sales team reach out to you right after the call.

Cliff: [00:02:12] So you guys. Have these leads you develop through, searching around through, different court records and whatnot. And then what are you doing? Needs from you. Is that how that works?

Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:02:20] Yeah, basically go to the courthouse in every County where we have this subscriber, get the probate data.

It's very time consuming process. Then we add extremely accurate phone numbers. We've got, templated letters. we've got included coaching, so it's really a complete system. And we'll basically give you all the information and teach you to reach out to these people and be able to help them.

One of our salespeople can walk you through the whole system, start to finish and probably five to 10 minutes. And as soon as this call's over until two o'clock, I'll have one of them reach out to you. All right.

Cliff: [00:02:50] Thank you.

Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:02:51] All right. Fair enough.  Next up is phone number ending in seven three, six, eight.

Real Estate Loans: Private Money vs Hard Money Real Estate Lenders [00:02:56]Christina: [00:02:56] This is Christina. I'm here in Texas and I don't have a win because I'm new. I haven't gotten my first set of leads yet, but, I do have a couple of questions. what is the difference between a PRI private money lender and a hard money lender? Or are they the same?

Chad Corbett (Coach): [00:03:10] So typically, it's kind of semantics, like they're both private lending, unregulated commercial lending from, private non-institutional lenders.

but typically private lending refers to the dentist or the doctor down the street or the probate seller who just got a big windfall of cash. And oftentimes that's going to come with no origination points and an interest rate of somewhere from six to 10%. Where hard money is more of the institutional investor groups that are offering private, investment loans.

That's usually going to come with points, origination points from 1% to 4%. And interest rates anywhere from 8% to 18%. And oftentimes, depending that depends on your experience level and the price point of the project, but it's either way they're there basically no nine at nine non-bank loans, that are made B2B.

If you look, if you search,  ask the expert, you can look, you can find the interview that Jim referenced in our YouTube channel, you can find it on auto It's part of a series called ask the experts. And we did a, thing with, Rick roll from GoNav capital, and they're the bridge between the two really.

they are, they're not a traditional hard money lender. They're not as attractive their rates and terms. Aren't as attractive as what you can negotiate on your own and your own community or the private loans, but there's somewhere in between.  it's there. Less aggressive terms. Like it's, if you're just getting started and you have experience and you're looking to scale quickly, like they're really, they're a good resource.

Christina: [00:04:43] Okay. And then a follow-up question to that if I may is  one of the reasons why I'm so attracted to this program is the ability to become an investor, which I've never done, but I've been wanting to, since I was in my twenties,  you guys helped me structure those deals,  or is it just sleep only?

Chad Corbett (Coach): [00:05:01] No. that's a big part of what these calls are about. if you listen to the archive of these, I don't know that there's ever been a week where we didn't end up transaction engineering something.  so if if you find that, bring us as many facts as you can, this is what the asset value, this is the reason, the ARV or the retail value.

This is what the seller says. They want.  as many details as you can give us on the asset value and the motivation, the reason they're motivated, then their level of motivation. Then we can start to determine how much equity is there and what strategy can be applied based on their level of motivation and the equity level in the asset.

And really, I've found I can fit pretty much any residential, any probate deal. I can sit with them one of six strategies,  and that's Part of what we do in mastery is show all the potential ways that you can work with these families and monetize the deals. It really fits within six, six or six different strategies.

Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:05:54] And I was gonna, I was going to also add, if you get one on a Friday afternoon, you don't have to wait until the following Thursday, just send us an email. Or you can jump on Bruce's our full-time coach. He's a very seasoned,  realtor and investor. You can, you're entitled as a subscriber to a free coaching call with him every month.

And if you need more than that, he's available also.  yeah, no, we'll help you. We'll help you. We'll help you structure them. What I loved, I've been buying and selling for 40 years. What I loved about the NAB cap, I tested it and I went and put a deal. I was working on in there and I answered five questions.

And in five minutes I had an approval at 8%. Which is pretty good for a hard money loan. most of them out there are 12 to 15%. So their interest rates are pretty reasonable for an easy loan like that. And the fact that you can get an answer real quick online is very appealing, before you, you want to go into making that offer and dealing with the person, knowing that you have the funding and kind of having an idea of what it is.

Christina: [00:06:49] Okay. I'm really excited. I appreciate all your help and I am starting to assemble my team. I got a web address from GoDaddy last night. so I'm like this trying to get my, and, there's so much to listen to. So I just wanted to call you all. Thank you so much. but that's all my questions today.

Thank you.

Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:07:07] Yeah, you're very welcome. And I was just going to add, you don't have to, we've got seven, 800 hours worth of content. If you have a particular question,  our website is extremely robust. You can just go to that search bar, put in almost any subject, and you'll find where we talked about it or covered it, or you'll find where you can find it on one of these calls.

It's like Google, you may have to play around with it a little bit. You can get almost any question answered. There are those that I don't think too. I don't think there's too much over the last seven years as it come up at least once. So appreciate your input. Thank you. All right. Thank you.

All right. We have, next up is phone number ending in zero three zero nine. You're up next. How Do You Follow Up On Real Estate Leads That Hung Up? [00:07:46]

Christian: [00:07:46] Hey guys, it's Christian here. I just want to say hi to Chad again. And the host, I asked you a question yesterday and I was in the call, but this is a follow-up to my question yesterday. And I couldn't really talk yesterday.

Cause that was a store. And I apologize for that. But, remember when I asked you, what do you do when you hang up? When, probate a PR person hangs up the phone. What do you do after that? And I know you mentioned that you pretty much call back and you just say you got disconnected and how do you follow up with, after, you just stay silent.

And then the other question I had, or that goes along with it, how often do you follow up after they do that to you? Do you continue to call them five, seven times or you just let it go and don't bother them again. So it all  depends on the context.

Chad Corbett (Coach): [00:08:28] If you got engagement and then you said something that offended them and they hung up, I, I usually, I read the people and read the situation.

So if they seem distracted or like they're having a bad day, Then I'll call back the next day. But if they seem like they've gotten so much, press sure they're just seeing red. And I like, they're not, I don't think I'm going to be able to engage with them tomorrow. And I might follow up with them in a couple of weeks at a different time of day.

For example, if they're super pissed at nine in the morning, They just got the work and they're late for a meeting and they answered their phone. Anyways, I wouldn't call back at nine. I would call back at 1230 and see if I could speak to a different version of that person on their lunch breaks. So I would take into account the time of day and what's happening around them.

What actually, what was said in the conversation,  and their level of aggressiveness and determining how soon and how often I would try them again. Does that answer your question? Yeah. And then when you call back again the say few weeks, or now, do you still do the USP again or you just make it like, Hey Christian here, just following up, just wanting to see how everything's coming along or how would you handle it again?

I would think back your good notes of what happened in the conversation for me. Like when you talked to thousands of people, I leave myself clues, right? Like  angry, short, Traffic noise in the background. And when you reconnect with them, it's not, you don't have to start over with the probate USP.

You can say, Hey Christian, this is Chad. we talked a couple of weeks ago and I think I caught you at a bad time. It sounded like you're in a hurry and out in traffic. So is this a good time to talk for just a couple of minutes and just be ready? Cause you're going to hear it. Who is this?  Christian, when we spoke a couple of weeks ago.

It's okay. I'll remind you. We've got a team of folks here locally that help families going through probate. And as part of that, we try to reach out early and often to the families because we realized that any time surprises come up. So I was just touching base to make sure everything's going okay for you guys.

And if not see if somebody from our team could help you with whatever you might help with, is there anything that's off track or you're not a hundred percent clear about. And just re-enter it that way.

Christian: [00:10:36] Okay. That makes sense. Okay, cool. Perfect. Yeah. That's the only question I have today. I appreciate your time.

Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:10:41] All right. Thank you, sir. Next up is phone number ending in zero zero five five. You're up next.

Are Niche Websites Worth It For Your Real Estate Business? [00:10:49] Caller 1: [00:10:49] Hey, how are you, Chad? Hey, can you hear me today? I'm doing great. great mastery session. Enjoyed it. so I've got a question for you. So where are we at with, what I noticed is we didn't see any like examples of what, what a website would look like and where do I find that?

Or how do I, get my mind around, starting to work on that. Sure. And I actually,  we had so many people in so many questions. I normally show that as part of mastery.

Chad Corbett (Coach): [00:11:14] If you go to . That'll give you an example. That's just one of many you can call in and ask to talk to our web team and they can show active sites.

This is just a one on one of the examples. This is a basic, before any customization is done.  But we, they can share with you, some of the sites they're most proud of and the ones that I like showing off and some of the other templates or, Based sites, but modern com.

It's a WordPress application so we can make it look and feel any way you want. You can customize, add testimonial pages, video pages, where you can literally do anything you want because it is WordPress.

You let us know what your needs are. we can also connect it. If you have a core website, we can connect those. So there's a clean interface between the two and the customer doesn't even really notice that they're bouncing between two websites. Oh, I see. Okay. Sure. And, the, you're you're you're not ready with that.

any, content or guidance on how to, market, online, with the YouTube videos and the Facebook posts and the Facebook videos and things like that. Because as I'm talking to other investors, That's what seeming to be working right now. Matter of fact, I was shocked.

I was looking at my phone. I'm like, Oh, I know that guy. And on my own phone, I know a guy who buys, repositions multi-families is, raising, I guess doing, raising capital for another fund to go buy things. And this is a local guy I'm like, wow, presented himself. he's one of Just like one of these national guys when you're looking on your phone, you're watching a YouTube video and a commercial comes up.

I was pretty impressed. And now I see what they're saying, this is, this is, it's, if you advertise it correctly, you get your market correctly. This is gonna pop up. And, I'd love to be able to, Get that in those executors and executor fixes and the probate attorney spaces as quickly as possible, because I think it's just, it's going to separate is nobody's doing that.

Sure. And I don't have a digital marketing course for this niche right now. That's going to be one of the modules that are built into the new marketing part of probate mastery version 2.0 like the masterclass. So over the next few months, I will actually take the time and show you step by step for now.

and Kat can link to these in the show notes. There's a couple of recent mastermind calls where we've talked about it. It's in long form, but. You essentially take your probate list, export that from my probate leads, import it into Facebook as a custom audience, and you match on first name, last name, all five phone numbers.

If you have that many and the email address, and what you'll find is you'll get, you won't see this, but we know from working directly with Facebook, we have about a 90% match rate on those audiences.  if you have a thousand probate leads bloated in, we're going to be in front of 900 of them daily basis and what that's going to hyperfocus your budget.

So your actual cost per result, your CPR is really low because it's a small, highly targeted list. And what we find is we get daily impressions like ranging from. 25 times a day, they actually see your brand. So you never know what's going to work. Video works really well. So what I usually suggest is you pick a quiet morning and go stand in front of your local courthouse.

Something that has, it's an emotional. Image like, so that's going to interrupt them by triggering their reticular activation system. And then you go, Oh my God, that's my courthouse. I was just there last week. And then you've got captions playing and it's just a short, no more than 32nd video saying, are you going through probate and New Jersey?

Did you know that there's a social enterprise right here in the community to help families through this click learn more? And when they click, they land on a landing page on your, on the website, we were just talking about your WordPress site and there you have, you could do it as an about page. You could do it on the homepage, but there you have, or a landing page, but there you have a video of you talking directly to the family, as you would.

If someone had just walked up and said, Hey, I want to introduce you to John DOE. He's an executor of estate. and I know you can help him. That's mechanically. Like you don't script it. You don't like just talking to the camera the way you would talk to a human and that's really effective and you need a call to action.

So you could have them download something. And as part of that, download that your, the opt-in would include the ability to add to SMS market, to them, to drop ringless voicemail, to email market. So you can use social media to get, let's say we get a thousand of them and we have 4%, Conversion like you tighten that audience down, then you can start to drip, email drip to them.

You can S you can text message market. You can drop ringless voicemail, and you can do this for pennies. now the one thing I would say is you're just getting started, and this is, it's interesting because it's something new and innovative. I still want to see you get your letters out and get on the phones.

First. This is supplemental. This isn't your primary marketing methods. Because we know direct mail works. We know phone calls, work, digital marketing takes some time like it's you never, and even if it's working today, it doesn't mean it's going to be working tomorrow. So use the tried and true methods first.

And then once you've got that in place, then step in and start doing the digital stuff. And one thing I'll suggest if you have somebody there in your market that, sounds like you think he's doing a good job. Reach out to him and ask him what agency he's using. And maybe you can maybe he'll give you a referral and you can actually have that agency do all the work that I just confused you with.

Okay. Sounds good. Yeah. And I'll look. Yeah. So I've got just two other, the gentlemen per Nell is his name. you're you're you're good student. Prunella. Did you meant, was that his name? David Prunella or Panella? Can you hear me? You mentioned yesterday. Sorry. Sorry. You had mentioned yesterday about, he did a really, I think I heard this right, great custom postcard specifically for surviving spouse members.

Do you, is there a copy of that or should we reach out to him individually? I'd love to see what that. That looks like. Cause I know that's a little bit more of a trickier type of you go to the Facebook group, all the leads mastermind and the search bar type in P a N E L L. And you'll see his activity.

One of those things will be a video that he made leafing through about a 20 page premium booklet that he made. And that's what I was referencing. Oh, okay. We've got nine more in the queue.

Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:17:39] Hopefully that helps. We've got a full queue. We'll try to get to all of you today. next up is phone number ending in zero, zero six, eight.

You're up next. Proven Method For Beating Your Real Estate Competition: [00:17:47]

Joe: [00:17:47] Good morning. This is Joe in Sacramento.  Hey Joe, not a seasoned probate person, but I only found you guys about four or five months ago, and I thought it was very astute the way you go about, giving people much more service than just saying you're a real estate agent and I've beaten out my big competition several times in the last few months because of what you taught me.

So I wanted to thank you. That's great to hear. Yup. Appreciate the, so you've done several deals where you had competition and you won out because,  you went above and beyond, just wanting to list the house, correct? Correct. My competition, who I know very well, because we've been competing for.

15 years. He always goes in from the standpoint of, as-is sale. And I went in from a service standpoint of what could we do to the house to bring more equity to the estate and people just, they, they see the difference and, it just works really well. So thank you.  that's great to hear. We appreciate it.

And, actually David Pannell is in the queue. Chad, do you want me to go to him next? He must have a comment. Oh, you have another question? Go ahead, sir. Yeah.  I have a client who's selling properties that will net him almost a million dollars. What would you suggest he do with it, with the money?

Chad Corbett (Coach): [00:19:12] Do you have capital needs?

are you buying and selling or flipping? Yes. So turn them into a private lender is one of the best things you can do because that serves your business. And,  at those rates, even if you're charging an 8% is money's going to double every seven years.

Okay.  the other things you can do, you can, you can help him diversify by setting up a long-term long-term care plan for himself on a state plan for himself and his family.  five to nine college savings plans. We try to make sure everybody has an opportunity to meet with our registered investment advisor.

And with our estate planning attorney, because probate, sees he's about to learn, it's going to cost five to 8% of the gross value of the estate when he settles out the administration costs. So helping him avoid that in future generations and actually take that million dollars and turn it into multiples of millions, statistically.

Without leadership. 75% of families will completely deplete their inheritance within 18 months. And I don't mean investing, spending. So we try to, at the point where we have a, an emotional high connection, like where they really think we're the smartest people in the world. Let me try to use that influence to get them to do the right thing and invest in their family and the generational wealth and the preserving generational wealth.

So the good news is he's not going to have a tax liability on that because of the step-up basis rule. So this is a, for most people, I once in a lifetime opportunity to invest somebody else's money tax without paying a tax on it.  so you could, look, ask him what his needs are, ask him, how long do you want to work?

what do you have in mind for your family and potentially carve off a couple hundred thousand dollars for private money loans to you or your investors take a couple hundred thousand and pay for everybody at the next generations college.  really just focus on what his needs are and what his dreams are, and maybe suggestions, and just know that if you don't, he'll probably spend it.

Do you have a registered investment advisor that knows about this? Yeah. That's why I choose to work with RIA because they're there they're educated to a much higher standard to help go much stricter code of ethics. So they have a fiduciary responsibility to every client regardless of the investment vehicle.

And there's a website. If you go to broker, you can actually search by zip code. You can search at the firm level or the individual licensee level.  but that's a good place to start and see who the RAs are in your market. But they're typically smaller boutique indie firms and they don't mind working with, they certainly want to work with somebody who has a million dollars, but they also don't mind working with someone who right now only has $10,000.

it's a lot different than the, the big financial institution experience. Okay, thank you.

Bruce Hill (Coach): [00:21:57] Hey Chad. Alrighty. Let me chime in. Let me throw in real quick, before you move on Jim. there are a lot of people that inherit money that they're not going to,  they might be looking for something that's a little bit bigger.

They might want to invest themselves. And of course, We all know that a lot of times that person that's never been an investor before has no real estate background, they're going to get themselves in trouble. So if it's somebody that doesn't want to just give you a private money loan, but they want to be involved.

One of the things that I've done with a lot of them in my market is turn them into investors that are in a private investment club that I manage. And if you have a really good business attorney that sets it up properly, you can.  turn this money into investors that, that you make all the decisions on the real estate flips or buy and hold investments, whatever strategy you're using it for your investment.

And, it's just another option. If somebody's not willing to just. Turn their money over to you. It may be an 8% return if they want to be a principal and the transaction with you as the manager that gets to pull all the triggers and run the flip or run the buy and hold investments in something that awesome.

good suggestion.  We referenced David Pinel, David, we have 10 more people in the queue, and I know we can talk to you, but hopefully for our hours, but we always want to hear your words of wisdom. Thanks for chiming in.  Chad had the best, where's the window wisdom. I just want to answer that guy's question.

David Pannell: [00:23:21] I don't know who just answered. So I'll just chime in on that. It's, it just, you guys offer so much resources and all I did, I needed something. I've always brought things to an appointment. So I just wanted something that looked really professional. So I just made a, I made a PDF book that I could send people by the mail or by email.

And it's just, it's, it's a 28 page resume, basically everything I've done in probate sale.  you could start with a regular resume of what you've done and I can, I'll share my resume on the group, but,  it's just basically a resume template so that they know that I know what I'm talking about.

so it's the USP basically in a big,  28 page book that it just helps me convert the deals either to a nursing appointment or to a wholesale.  it's not a postcard, letters and postcards work, but,  it's bringing something to the presentation of why you should be there more value. And David, you said you're fulfilling those at three bucks, is that right when you mail it?

Yeah. So three or $4 and not to every single lead, but the ones you have a good dialogue with like ones that are, that are serious. And if it's really targeted to the ones. I just by calling them over the years now that I've, they fall into three categories and it's the spouses is the, it's the family, the relatives, or is the out account administrator.

And once you identify what category they fall in,  and then, they have a house to sell based on your probate plus. Once you have a conversation that they're going to sell a house in six months, then they're getting that book from me probably twice over that six months.  and I'm going to get an email from him and just dial in their information because then I can retarget them and offer them the same book on Facebook.

So they're constantly seeing that and I don't expect them to ever open it or read it. I really don't.

That's great. Great tips, David. Thank you.


Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:25:13] All right, appreciate it. Next up is phone number ending in six zero three five. You're up next?

How to Turn Closed Probate Cases Into Real Estate Opportunities [00:25:19]

Caller 2: [00:25:19] Hello, I just have, one question and then  like advice for another one. Sure. So my question is when the cases come up that they're closed, does that mean that there's no opportunity for us to go and help them?

Chad Corbett (Coach): [00:25:31] No. I certain number of families, upwards of maybe 10 to 20%.  actually not make a decision on whether or not to sell the real estate. So they'll do a, like an inter family transfer and it'll show that the house went from John DOE, the decedent to, into a trust or to a single family member.

So a number of people, and this is especially prevalent in Colorado. A number of people will actually close the probate. And just transfer the real estate out to one of the heirs. And then they'll, eventually they will end up selling that. So there's opportunity beyond the probate closing and real estate.

It's just not, there's, we are far more likely that real estate will be sold during probate, but not everybody gets around to it. The attorneys ready to go ahead and close the case. He's listen, you're going to get this anyways. Let's just transfer it out and close this up and you can decide later when you want to sell it or what do you want to do with it?

Caller 2: [00:26:25] Oh, okay.  let's see. Am I am the kind of advice that I have? Do you guys necessarily go after the cases where the administrator lives with the deceased or if there's like air? So living at that same house, Yeah. And oftentimes it's the surviving spouse. You can see the descendant name will match the personal or the last name we'll to personal representative.

And they both have the same address.

Chad Corbett (Coach): [00:26:46] A lot of times that's a surviving spouse and that's one of the things David just referenced. So it's more sensitive. but understand a lot of times, the average senior citizen in the United States, according to the federal reserve only has $24,000 on liquidity.

I started life savings, 24,000 bucks. So they're oftentimes on fixed income. They, the house they're living in represents 50 to 80% of their net worth. And now all of a sudden, instead of getting two social security checks, they're getting one and they didn't have a proper retirement plan. They didn't have a proper estate plan.

So the urgency, even though they may. a month after the passing, they may say, I'll never leave this house. And what we know from the nursing home industry is that's the only plan for a 78.8% of senior citizens survey by the nursing home industry say that they only have one plan. I'm going to live out my life and my house.

But only 20%, according to the CDC actually get that plan works the other 80% and the thrown into a stressful situation because the lack of planning created a lot of stress and earnings to be in the family. So it's all my God, mom can't pay her bills or power's been turned off. She can't take care of the house.

He can't afford to pay the pool boy or the lawn guy. We got it. And then the family has to step in. So you want to make contact with those people, even if their mindset right now is I'll never sell this house, I'll die here.  okay, fair enough. I'm not trying to force you to sell the home. I wanted to let you know that there's a team here in the community that can help families and these transitionary period.

So whether that means connecting you with social services or, transportation or the different living situation, just know. If there's ever anything you need, please call us. we have really in the situation you're in, we have never met a family that we couldn't help. So is it okay with you if I just touch base every couple of months.

Okay, perfect. And whatever that frequency is, but. Letting them just softly introducing your, the concept of what you do and having them be aware of that when you call back as that urgency builds and as the financial start to slip, or the maintenance gets out of hand, you never know the next month, the second month or the third month.

How motivated they're going to be. And it happens all the time. Most, a lot of your com list me calls will be from the surviving spouses and, they file probate. They get into the middle of that. And then all of a sudden they realize, Oh crap, I'm going to run out of money. And then they panic and oftentimes dump equity.

And if you look at it as I look at it as an obligation to those folks, because they're, they might not be financially savvy enough to realize they're not forecasting, that they don't have enough money and eventually they're going to run out. Or eventually the cost of maintaining that property is going to eat up the savings that they have, and they don't have a regular income.

So I feel an obligation to touch base and check in on them. And that, if you can do that, you start to build trust with them. And then when they find themselves in that urgent situation, you're the only person in the universe. Like they just allow you to come in and help them. Okay, cool.

that was all.  we do a series called tips from a trainer, a video blog series. If you go to all the in the top, Search bar put in surviving spouse. And there's a tips from a trainer video where we share some stories and techniques and different things. In addition to what we just talked about, you might want to check that out.

Bruce Hill (Coach): [00:30:05] Okay. Chad,  here's another thing with the surviving spouses, especially those that are elderly. We. Often, and a lot of folks make the mistakes that surviving spouse is the only decision maker. When I think we're really kidding ourselves with that, it's normally the kids that have tremendous influence over what their elderly parent does.

And so just going off of the immediate wishes of the surviving spouse and saying, Hey, I'm not going to follow up with them is a big mistake because the kids are going to get in there and start,  putting some pressure and some influence on their parent to say, look, why don't you come move with me?

Why don't you go to this assisted living place? They're going to put a lot of pressure. And most of the time. And I don't know the statistic like Chad does, but most of the time those houses will be sold.  just because of the children over the shirt.

Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:30:57] All right. Excellent guys, I'm going to go ahead and I'm going to close the queue cause we've got still got six or seven more people. Chad, you had another comment for that person. No. I just said that's really good advice. Yep. Good advice. Thank you, Bruce. All right, next up is phone number ending in five nine two two.

You're up next.

Recommendations for Real Estate Virtual Assistants [00:31:15] April: [00:31:15] Hey guys. How's it going? Great. How are you? My name is April. I'm great, sir. My name is April. I'm not a real estate agent. I'm a virtual assistant and I work with Kim Barber.  I really wanted to go in with a Q last week. Guys got a lot of questions about virtual assistants, but I couldn't. So I just want to know the answer, some of the questions there.

I believe the one guy didn't, did have a question about what is going to be the probate or it's going to be admin,  virtual assistants who, everything from admin to answering the phone calls, to setting up appointments and all that. Just one, you guys to let you know about it. and I work with my out desk, Oh, great. Yeah. We recommend you guys all the time. You're what you're one of the better ones. So thanks for the input. Any feedback or any questions for April? No, thanks for being here. you got to hear us recommend you

Jim Shares Multiple Deals from Probate Leads [00:32:01]Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:32:01] Next up is Mr. Forsythe. You're up next, sir. Hey, Jim, how y'all day doing? Hey Jimbo. What's up?

Jim Forsythe: [00:32:07] Oh, I just go give you a good story.  I've been working with the, attorneys here and we closed two yesterday of his own property.  he's got one other forced to sell and then, it looks is going to list, five more, probate, if we don't sound striped to one of our investors and that's from one client attorney, it's a three, it's an attorney and then, three other, probate leads.

So it's actually four different people we're working with and helping. So yeah. But it was one source the attorney to his own property and then referred to three more.

Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:32:40] Wow. That's great. And you, Jim, you just start made up your mind maybe a month or two ago, I think, to start working the attorney end of it.

And focusing equally on that. It's not something you've always done or is it,

Jim Forsythe: [00:32:51] yeah, it's not. And we've had meetings with, two others and we've got another one scheduled. we had it scheduled for yesterday and he couldn't make it. So we're rescheduling it for next week. And then we've got other targets.

We're just doing, trying to do one a week and then hopefully good for you. So you are, you're just, you're looking down your leads. You're seeing who the players are. And then how are you setting the appointment? Are you just showing up at their office? You call in ahead. How are you getting to meet with them?

calling ahead,  the ones we've dealt with so far are people that I've met in the past. the ones we're going to, we're going to be yesterday was the, associate of one. I met with him last week and it says, they're not partners in the same office. And, they also do probate. And so meeting with either two or three.

Of those attorneys. So we'll actually hit two or three other sources, and then I've got another lady that I met about a year or so ago. And, we're going to meet with her in a couple of weeks and probably after the first of the year and just keep hitting. And we got, we go down through and look at the attorneys that have the most,  probate.

Leads each month. And so we can shut out the ones that have the most number, like random number of leads. And those are the ones that we're concentrated on right now.  that's great.

Chad Corbett (Coach): [00:34:07] Good for you and Jim, go ahead, Chad, we've talked about this a lot. Other people get to hear us talk about it, but if you don't mind share with everybody, what was your opening statement?

Like what values did you demonstrate to get the appointment?

Jim Forsythe: [00:34:18] the first attorney was just someone that I've known. I just hadn't really dealt into him. And, we just found out that, he went out to lunch with us and, while we're sitting there having lunch, he says, Oh, by the way, I've got three personal properties that, I need to sell right now.

And he gave us that information. And then while we were sitting there at lunch, then we, you talked with him about anybody else that he might've any of his probate clients that we might be able to help, as it turns out, there's going to be like three of his clients and, one client, one of the problems, please.

We're not sure if we're going to be able to sell the hell of a reverse mortgage on it. And, it may be,  Too much work to do to make it anything work. being with one of my investors in about an hour to show it to him,  if I can't figure out a way to sell it to him, I may call Chad or Bruce back and, see if I've got any ideas, but, it's a reverse mortgage.

one 43 is what the O on it. And, there's about $80,000 of repairs that could be done. And the property is only worth about two 50.  you do the numbers real quick. That could be a potential short sale. So reach out to, to Pam. If that's the case, she's done quite a few reverse mortgages at short sales.

Oh yeah, I know that. I hadn't thought about it.  can you do where they do a short sale on reverse mortgage? Absolutely. Yep. Okay. Yeah, we've done the thing that's done 50 of them. I'll bet. Okay. I'll keep the other one.

Chad Corbett (Coach): [00:35:45] The other thing to consider Jim is as long as you have a savvy investors, that's aware of the timeline because it is a ticking clock, but you can actually take those subject to.

And just leave the heck. I'm alone in place as you flip the house or transition it to a rental so they can buy the house subject to just know that there's a foreclosure clock ticking. So they have to finish the project. So they need to get rehab to get a tenant in there and then get it, do a cash out refi with a fresh note against it.

but as long as you have a savvy investor who understands that timeline, And understands that,  you can actually take these and basically grab a free rental property until you get it rehabbed and get a tenant in it and then do a cash out refi and had a long-term buy and hold. So that's just the way for everybody to make sure that your buyer gets the deal and that you get paid faster.

A short sale will work as well. Okay. I appreciate it.

Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:36:39] Great job, Jim. We appreciate it, man. Keep it up. And I think people, we people often ask us, should I work the. The heirs or the attorneys. And we always say, yes, they're  the heirs are typically the now business, but the, but an heir is probably, or a personal representative is probably only going to have the experience once in their life.

A good probate attorney can turn into a career where the deals for you, so great job realizing that and taken advantage of. And man, thanks for the other so far. I think you're definitely in the running for wind of the week. Thank you, sir.  Hey. Jim and Jim to chime in on that really fast.

Bruce Hill (Coach): [00:37:13] what, I get this question all the time from our subscribers that they'll set an appointment up with an attorney and then they call me and say, I don't know what to say. How am I going to prove them that I'm an expert? And if you're not an expert yet, it doesn't mean that you don't have tremendous value.

When you go on those attorney appointments. When you have conversations, you just sit down and you tell them, look, I'm taking this meeting with you. And I don't want this to be a one-way street where I'm begging you for referrals and I'm not offering value.  of course I want referrals. I want business from you and you to, connect me with clients that have a need.

But ultimately what I want to know is what do I need to do to make your life easy? And instead of going in and assuming that, everything that they need exactly how to make their life easy, you just ask and they'll tell you, most of the time that answer is just take really good care of my clients and I'll be happy, but by walking in and making the statements, you want it to be two way street, where you provide as much or more value to them, then you get, it really sets you apart.

You don't even have to be the expert yet. You can work on that later. So if you're holding off on calling attorneys, I'd say don't hold off anymore. Just set meetings up, have conversations, tell them that you want to provide value and you don't want it to be a one-way street from them to you and say, what can I do to make your life and your client's life easier.

I am launching get five listings, right? Jim, go ahead, sir.

Jim Forsythe: [00:38:37] Another thing that we're doing. we're having each of the attorneys that we've met with so far are doing, videos for us. And of course, then we're going to take and post them on my ATL website. We're going to post them on all of our, partners, websites.

And, and of course we're telling the attorneys, if we're going to be, they can't advertise for themselves, we can advertise for them. And so we're going to be putting their videos in our.  email drip campaigns that we're sending to our probate leads. And of course, some of those are not going to have a probate attorney.

And so they may see an attorney on one of our, emails and they may wind up calling them. So we're offering that as a,  something that we can do for them. And so far, all three of the attorneys that we've talked to. Absolutely. We'd be glad to do a video for you. And, that's great. Good job, sir. Keep coming back.

Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:39:26] We appreciate all the input.  We got three more on the website and the queue we may get to everyone. Next up is, eight two, one three. You're up next.

Building A Strong Relationship With Fix and Flippers [00:39:34]Fed: [00:39:34] Hey guys. It's Fed. How are you? Hey, great Fed.

All right. so the question actually has to do, since we, I noticed, many people have been talking about flipping, so I have a, client who is a flipper and he actually asked me, he's Hey, since you're in the probate world, Why don't you see if we can get into one of those,  so that there's not as much competition now, this flipper actually does not have much if any experience flipping.

So he's asking me like, Hey, what do we need to look out for and all this stuff, and I'm not sure I'm going about it the right way. So what I've been doing, even when I searched for properties is let's say the property is, let's say a thousand square feet.  then I go look at what something double the size would be and how much it would sell for.

But I know that with zoom, you can always double square footage. What you guys have done suggestions on that because they said maybe I'm doing I'm overdoing.

Chad Corbett (Coach): [00:40:33] I think you need to connect them with a mentor.  and you want him to be, to be a serious buyer and a sustainable buyer. Then he needs to learn. He needs to learn a lot of people try flipping houses, very few people staying sustainable businesses in it.  and he needs to understand, different acquisition models.

like it's just, it's too much for you to do.  his job is to tell you what his strategy is. And how he values assets. Your job is to go find them for him. Your job is not to teach him a strategy and an go find them. so I would suggest that he go to a local REIA suggest that he finds a mentor.

Now the one thing you can do to help start creating some momentum for him is go into your MLS pull 24 months of data and short. Okay. search for LLC and the seller name field. And,  you're going to find a bunch of, there'll be rental properties and there'll be flipped, but just select the ones that look like they're, they're flipped and then export that like NLS detail sheet for each of them.

And then if you can find that the previous listing, so here, like here's what he paid for it. And the photos of it. Here's what he sold it for. And the photos of it. And you could maybe make him like a portfolio out of your MLS records of what everybody else has done and your marketplace in the last 24 months.

And that just get him juiced to go, Oh my gosh, I could take a house that looks like this and make it like that and make this much money.  but there's a lot to learn. There's a lot to learn. And I think it's outside of it's unreasonable for you to teach him everything.

Fed: [00:42:08] yeah. Cause I feel like all he came at me with is he said, look, I'm all cash.

Let's say I buy it. I'm just going to throw numbers out there. But he said, let's say. I buy something for a million, all gladly put 500 grand into it, but then I want to make, I want to net 500 grand, but sometimes what you're buying is let's, you're going to have to add square footage, at least in the areas that he wants to be in.

So then he says, we'll find out how much I'm going to be able to get. And realistically not being an architect contractor or whatever, I can get a rough idea, but I feel like I'm running comps like crazy. And, without even being a hundred percent sure. Cause I'm not sure just how much the zoning is going to allow me to add.

sometimes it's 40%, sometimes it's more, what town are you in? Los Angeles?  you have ginormous real estate investors association and everybody's spelling something like he should be able to connect with a mentor.

Chad Corbett (Coach): [00:43:05] What I would suggest is it sounds like, Hey, he's a, he's probably his biggest investment threat,  with that kind of money and no knowledge, he's likely to go by.

What I would speak to him if he were my client, I would say, listen, man, why don't I find you a seasoned investor? That's doing flips. We'll make you the lender and you can JV on the deal. So instead of taking an interest rate, you actually, you take a percentage of net profit, and I think I can get you 25% of net profit, but no promises.

I'll start the conversation. We'll meet. We'll have a drink. We'll talk about it. But if you have a buyer in your list, that is a seasoned flipper.  some of them, half of them are going to look at it as one. Hell no, I'm not going to change my train, my competition. But if you have a fix and flip investor who has an abundance mindset that.

Needs capital rather than paying for hard money loans and going through all that headache, they can just form a series, LLC, buy an asset together. He brings the capital, he gets to shadow them and watch the projects come together and learn from that investor. And then maybe he'll cut his teeth enough that he actually will know what to look for.

so that's the kind of service so that you can provide. I wouldn't, don't become his mentor unless you're charging that because he'll where he's gonna wear you out.

Fed: [00:44:24] Oh, he's been wearing me out. I feel definitely thank you for that advice. Cause that really does help. Yeah. So just be patient like the best deals are still to come, especially in LA.

Chad Corbett (Coach): [00:44:34] Like why don't you become a lender on a couple of deals and you can, that gives you your principal in the transaction. You have access to the house. You can go on material runs. You can. You can look at the contractor quotes, you can see the P and L like the way we booked this and the QuickBooks, because there are a lot of moving parts to flipping a house.

And the other thing that he's probably not aware of is how little of that money you get to keep compared to other strategies you get blistered on taxes. So the other question, if he were my client that I would ask is why do you want to flip out. And if it's  San Diego. Yeah. Anyways, another question I would ask him is why or why have you chosen the fix and flip strategy? And if it's because he thinks chip and Joanna Gaines are just the coolest damn people ever, I would challenge it on what are your investment goals?

What are your, what return do you demand? Because he's going to make more money. Over time as a buy and hold investor  and the shifting environment, he has way less risk. And in doing that, so you may be able to change his mind, turn him into a buy and hold investor. And then you just look at cap rates and gross rent multipliers, and the rehab becomes much easier and you can get him.

You can use that million dollars as a leverage paired with community bank financing, and he can buy a $10 million, or he can buy a $5 million portfolio with the money he has right now. But ultimately he'll make and keep a hell of a lot more money. So that's, my advice is ask him why, if he has sound reasons to be a fix and flip investors and get him over to a mentor.

Approaching Probate Attorneys Named As The Administrator [00:46:04]Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:46:04] Perfect. And we're going a little bit over time today, guys, Giovanni, you may be up probably going to be our last call of the day. What can we do for you?

Giovanni: [00:46:10] Hi guys, this is Giovanni San Diego, fairly new to, the probate scene. But I have a question and it's related to a couple of masterminds ago. Chad had mentioned, or one of you gentlemen mentioned about, when a, a case has, a PR as an attorney.

most likely 80% of those are. Assigned an attorney because no one has stepped up. So when making those calls to those attorney offices, and I also watched the, the John Fraker video, he had mentioned that, of course, this decline attorney,  privacy, do you have a recommendation of how to approach the gatekeeper and.

Chad Corbett (Coach): [00:46:44] Basically get in so that, the goal is set an appointment or to be able to get some information so that it can have a plan of attack on how to work that potential lead don't go after it at the lead level, go after at the referral relationship level. So you're not trying to get one deal. this is a public administrator or a fiduciary.

You're trying to get all of their deals for the rest of their career. So don't call and say, I'm calling about the state of John DOE and the house at one, two, three Walnut street, because that's what everybody else does you call and say something like, I didn't see Avani. I have a team of people right here in Roanoke to help families.

You've gone through probate and I keep seeing your, you guys pop up. And I think that what we do is perfectly complimentary. Like I have ideas of how I can help, attorney John Doe's scale his business, and I can actually Mark it for you. Where non-solicitation laws prevent you from doing that. You think he could have five minutes to talk?

And let that organic matter organic conversation about you supporting his small business. let that, let him ask, what is it that you do exactly. Then you talk about your full-blown service and then he'll connect the dots and it's okay. Once you're in rapport and you have good dialogue, it's geez.

Of all the cases you're working right now. there's gotta be something that you can dish off to me so I can help these families and you can handle more caseload. What would that be? Like? What can I help most of your, what do you think I can help most of your clients with? And then just got quiet.

And that will go to, Oh, what redundancy do I have that I don't get paid on it. This guy can get paid on, but the Jones estate I'll give him the Jones estate. So focus on the relationship, not the deal. Got it. All right. All right. Thank you guys. Another great call.  I want to challenge each of you as I always do.

Jim Sullivan (Host/Coach): [00:48:31] I want to thank you for being here. We had some great ideas. I have a feeling all of you should be picking up the phone and calling your attorneys, but take one thing.  w did inspired you on this call, go out and put it into practice and come back next Thursday and share the results with the group.

Be safe, be productive, and we will talk to you all the same time. Next Thursday. Take care of everyone.

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