Setting Expectations and Preventing No-Show Appointments | Prospecting Surviving Spouses | Probate Mastermind Podcast #315

Setting Expectations and Preventing No-Show Appointments | Prospecting Surviving Spouses | Probate Mastermind Podcast #315

Setting Expectations and Preventing No-Show Appointments | Prospecting Surviving Spouses | Probate Mastermind Podcast #315

Probate Mastermind Episode #315 | Recorded Live on February 18th, 2021.  

Join Us Live Every Thursday | Previous Episodes.


Episode Summary: 

In this episode of the Probate Mastermind Podcast, you’ll learn how to set expectations and prevent no-shows before appointments; how to prospect probate leads with a surviving spouse; how to adjust your pitch when prospecting leads that have already closed probate; and more!

***Most importantly, we hear more incredible success stories from rookies and veterans that are turning probate leads into listings, acquisitions, and wholesale deals!


These episodes are recorded as a live Question and Answer Mastermind with participation from agents and investors across the country. Thanks for tuning in, and don’t forget to subscribe for future episodes!


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Call Re-cap:

Accidental Attorney Networking

00:00 Accidental Attorney Networking 

David had an expired call this morning and the point of contact was a lawyer. The lawyer mentioned he was interested in carving a niche out of quit claim dates that were fraudulent to target title fraud.  David took this chance to try to build rapport, and while the attorney focuses on criminal law, he was open to referring him to other probate attorneys.



Appointments: Setting Expectations And Preventing No-Shows

12:57 Appointments: Setting Expectations And Preventing No-Shows.

Federico got the cold shoulder from a personal representative he had an appointment with.  The personal representative followed up with him after the scheduled appointment and asked him to reiterate all that he offers. She has not responded since. Is something odd about this?



Posted: No Trespassing Signs: Good or Bad?

22:53 Posted: No Trespassing Signs: Good or Bad?

Offering to post “No Trespassing Signs” on an ancillary probate property is a great strategy to get your foot in the door by providing quick and easy value. However, could doing so signal to outsiders that the house is vacant, and possibly encourage squatters? 



Adjusting Your Pitch for Leads That Have Completed Probate

26:04 Adjusting Your Pitch for Leads That Have Completed Probate 

When reaching out to probate leads where the probate case is already closed, should you change your approach? Jim and Bruce both share insights.




Brainstorming: Email Subject Lines

33:33 Brainstorming: Email Subject Lines 

Mike and Bruce discuss copy for email subject lines and how to write for different personality types.  In particular what are some headlines you should try using when sending emails to leads you haven’t spoken to yet?



Marketing Compliance for Licensed Agents

42:49 Marketing Compliance for Licensed Agents 

I’m an agent and investor - How should I include my disclosures in my mail marketing? Bruce describes how he includes subtle disclosures in some of his marketing, but also sends out other campaigns that are more brazenly focused on his real estate services.


Prospecting Surviving Spouses

44:12 Prospecting Surviving Spouses

What’s the best approach for providing value to surviving spouses when prospecting probate leads? A lot of people shy away from contacting surviving spouses, and many spouses truly believe they will stay in the house. However, most of the time real estate needs become inevitable.  Bruce discusses.




Looking to hear prospecting tips in action? Check out our live role play series.




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Episode Transcript

Probate Mastermind Real Estate Podcast Episode #315


A.I. Voice Narration: [00:00:00] Welcome to the Probate Mastermind Podcast. These episodes are recorded live once a week and are hosted by the coaches. Agents, investors, and wholesalers join the coaches each week for everything from marketing tips, sales, psychology, live deal analysis, transaction engineering, advanced real estate strategy and personal development.

You will learn to get more listings, more deals and find financial freedom by listening to these episodes. Be sure to catch show notes at and join our free Facebook mastermind community:



Welcome dynamic realtors and investors nationwide. Today is Thursday. February 18th, 2021.  Before we get started today, guys, we got a full queues, so get right to the callers, but we do have an announcement to make pretty exciting announcement. I think we, six, seven years ago now when we started this company, we decided we didn't want to just be a data company.

We can just sell your data, but if we don't give you the. Training and the tools to make sure you're successful with the data you aren't going to reach your potential, if you're successful at all. So we really, they tried to make this a systems company and we get great feedback with our training.

We've got an awesome full-time coach, Bruce we've. These role-play calls, we get a lot of good feedback. We've gotten particularly good feedback.  On the role-play calls, which we've been doing the first Wednesday of every month. And we've gotten such good feedback with them that we decided to discontinue them, verse that's right. Which we can work up it up with a budget hats program. And I wanted Bruce just to take a brief minute and tell you what we're going to, and this is going to start with the first Wednesday in in March coming up a week from next Wednesday, the new program's going to start. And Bruce, you want to just give them a real quick.

Summary. Yeah, a real real quick summary. He needs to start with why. So many of our subscribers that are taking advantage of a monthly call with me, a lot of times what's happening is I'm running over a lot of these foundational trainings that are, that they need to make them successful.

But sometimes it's four or five months before we can roll everything out. So we've decided to pack all those foundational pieces, including lots and lots of role-play. Into into Wednesday calls. So you don't have to wait a month between role-play calls and you also don't have to wait a month in between having a coaching session with me.

So they're going to be group.  We're going to be teaching you guys all about, team-building all about marketing to probate leads and a whole lot about. Probate dialogue. I don't want to call them scripts, even though there are some scripts, but that dialogue we're just teaching all the foundations that you need to be successful.

And you are pretty much going to be able to get in on one of those classes every week. Awesome. Great improvement. And before you guys, I told the sales team about this about 10 minutes ago. So they have no details. We're going to there won't be a posted on our website at each and every one of you will be getting an email.

We're going to do a system-wide. Email blast to completely explain the program and that'll be out well before the first call. So I'm not saying don't call our sales team. You're welcome to, but they don't have the details yet, but we'll make sure we get you all the details well in advance of the first Wednesday of next month.

So we're real excited about that guys. We feel like it's a significant upgrade to what we've been doing. And that's all I got to say about that. We've got a full queue. Tim, are you back? Do you want to add anything or I'm not sure he's back. I'm trying to log back. Okay. Anything you want to add to what you may not have heard what we said?

Yeah, I did right back in there. So the only, only thing I don't want to add is to just make sure that everyone is well aware that we continue to refine what we're offering in. Every time we do it with the eye to improving it and improving your success on all of that. And we've been really diligently working on making sure that we're adding data and adding content.

And all that sort of stuff. So that's what you end up with is even more and more. Value for the investment you make, not only in the leads that you get, but we know that you're here because we provide you with a system and we're just increasing the value of the system. We intend to do that as we go forward.

And that's why we do Amelia mailings and websites and ISA programs and training. And. Shower you with as much as we can possibly give you to make it be successful. So we do it because we appreciate you. And we're trying to make sure that we're diligent stewards of our role in the industry and hopefully our role in your life.

So thank you for being here and thanks, Bruce, for taking the lead to make this thing move forward. Thank you. That is awesome. Said guys, and we have got a full queue, so let's jump right in. First up this week is phone number ending in one, four, nine, five. You're up first.

David are you there? One 49, five hit the unmute button. David. There you go.

Marker [00:04:44]How you doing, buddy? Good. Good.  Yeah, I've got a point with Natalie tomorrow, so I'll be getting geared up questions.   Had an expired call this morning and the guy that the POC was was actually a lawyer and long story short  got into him looking.

He as a hobby, he  Was trying to see if he could monetize illegal title set. And  basically he said he found, he was, he found a niche where, he was, he's looking through quick claim deeds that were fraudulent. And of course, trying to figure out, how criminals were, deciding on what properties target to set in Heather Long story short  Him being a criminal lawyer.

I did ask him the question of how I could bring him value and, he said, really, there's not anything you can do for me. I don't really need any help. I did ask him if there were other lawyers that did probate. First I asked him that. And he he said, yes. The guy was just amazingly receptive.

I was like, is this kind of fixing to do something to me? Or, I just couldn't believe how congenial and everything he was. And so the gist of it is that, is there anything that can be offered via the whole title thing? When we start, when I start talking to these probate leads  because he said it's a really, it's beginning to get, to become a very big deal.

So I think that's the biggest thing that maybe you're gonna need to sit down and map out a little bit before you just immediately start. Offering this up, but there are a lot of different pain points that your probate leads and your personal representatives are not aware that they are going to experience.

And a lot of times they're in a pain point that they're experiencing a pain or a frustration that they think is completely normal so that they might not know that it's a pain until they see an alternative. I think you'd just need to sit down and map out  what that title says, what some of that might look like and just use it in your dialogue and your conversations to bring up as something that they didn't even know existed.

And ultimately. You're taking down them down this path of passive pain and what it might mean for them. If somebody did steal their title, I have no idea how popular it is. This is the first time I've heard anyone really bring it up. It's hard for me personally, to give you give you advice on it, how to bring it up to a PR I would just have further conversation and dialogue with this attorney to come up with that.

But but ultimately you probably, once you have an under a greater understanding of that, you probably should start to include it in your conversations when you're calling. Your probate leads and and just ask them if they've, if anyone's ever brought up the fact that there's some fraud going on and if anyone's ever brought up how how they might get taken advantage of, and if they say, no, you simply make a point and then ask them after the point what it would mean to them.

Or how damaging it would be if that happened. And it just further enhances the call and the value that you're bringing to the leads. I don't really have any other answer at this point until I dig into it and maybe start to think about what that conversation might be like. But I said, I think you're potentially onto something.

Yeah, David, the first thing I thought when you mentioned it, I don't know this to be true or not, but I suspect it's probably less than 1% of the probates. Have somebody tried to steal the title? I, as Bruce was talking, it occurred to me that I don't think I would mention it if they already have an attorney.

Because the last thing you want is them calling their attorney and saying, Hey, this realtor said you should look into, you might be making more work for your attorney. You know what I mean? If you don't want to call it the attorney and saying, Hey, is this a problem? Could you check into it for me?

It, if it were me, I would probably, if you're going to mention that if you notice the people that are doing it pro se that don't have an attorney, you might want to say, Hey, there's a lot of reasons you need an attorney. A matter of fact, I was just talking to an attorney the other day. That says, this title, that's not uncommon, it might be an opportunity to refer business to them.

I'm not sure if I would just routinely mention it to someone that already has an attorney. Do you agree Bruce or not? I agree.  We don't want to get into great detail on this. The more detailed you get  the more desperate it sounds.  So I would.  Roll back the actual description of how they might get taken advantage of and just make a blanket statement that I find a lot of personal representatives and families who've inherited property just don't want to be taken advantage of.

Does that make sense? So now you're categorically getting a yes. And if they want to know that you can start to go through details. Yeah, I liked that it could be taken advantage of by an unscrupulous contractor or a state sale company or a realtor. That's much more generic. I like that. I like the way that sounds.

Go ahead, David, you had a follow up question.   Yeah. Just the reason why I asked the question, it was just the oddest. It was a great conversation, but it was the oddest thing that he transferred into that. Because I actually had a construction customer about three months ago that she did have some ID theft and I suggested that she gets titled theft insurance just as a precaution.

And she was ecstatic. If anything, it just brought her that, that brought her peace of mind among everything else. So it was just a very odd. Coincidence today the one last question and I've got is that regarding the letters has anybody had success with, I've got a very industrious wife and a couple of middle school kids is can the letters be handled that way?

While I absorb the initial.  Investment of the leads.

I'll sure. I'll give you  brief. Pro and con obviously if you're absorbent absorbing costs and you're trying to stay in the program longer and get yourself. Absolutely. And I've done it before.  The issue that personally I ran into is people quit or they fall behind on schedules and then you're left scrambling without any marketing going out.

So if it's a band-aid or a bridge to getting to to profitability, It's not a terrible idea, but I, it's hard to hire and it's hard to keep even family members on top of the mail schedule that you're going to want if you're going to be successful. So just keep that in mind.  Certainly we're not blaming you if you're strapped on budget and you need to fulfill some of your own mail for a little bit.

And also David, go ahead. Sorry. It's just initial startup and like I said, I just, I don't know what I'm doing yet. Just I'm being quite Frank with you. This is just a totally new area. So just there you go. Or what's your. Go ahead. Jen go. No please. I'll wait till you guys are both done.

Go ahead, Bruce. What's your what's your doing David? It's a pretty common question. And personally, I really can't blame you for having that question or anyone.  Because I've done it as well. It's just a more unpredictable marketing schedule. So I'm going to encourage you that if you're going to do that, use it more as a bridge and then eventually get your profitability up and get to the point where you can systemize it.

Not have to put that on yourself or your family. Got it. Yep. The only other thing I was going to add, David, and this is very, this is really obvious, but sometimes it's easy to overlook it when you. When you're making the comparison, make sure you factor in all the costs,  the the ink on your printer, the paper, the envelopes.

And then determine if the difference is worth your time or not. If your kids are working for free, it might be, if you're, if your wife's got nothing to do it, it's probably pretty close though to be in break even, if you paid a minimum wage, you're probably going to be breakeven to let us do it for you, but there are certainly people that do it.

Okay. Okay. Thank you so much. All right. Thank you, sir. Appreciate it. All right. Next up in the queue is phone number ending in eight two one three. We got a frequent flyer. How are you doing so I'm well, how are you? Good buddy. What's up?

Marker [00:12:57]I just have a follow-up question for something I asked last week.

So it was regarding the wind. The wind was that I scheduled an appointment with a PR who didn't have an attorney. I was supposed to meet with her this past Saturday. I followed up with her a few times prior to the Saturday appointment. And then finally, Saturday. I saw she wasn't getting back to voicemails, so I decided to text her and confirm that appointment.

And then she said, Hey, look, we're going to have to reschedule, but tell me more about your services. Send me something about what you provide and all that stuff. So it's almost as if, although on our initial call, she understood what the value that was being offered was, and then it's almost as if it.

She regressed.   She's not very responsive at the moment. I sent her an email with a copy of the letter that was sent out through you guys and then briefly summarized in the body of the text. Just how I got her number and why she was contacted and so forth.  She didn't respond to that and has not been responding.

So I'm just trying to maybe strategize on the best way to continue staying in front of her without being the aggressive splash, what could come off as suspicious person that she doesn't know who's contacting her. Yeah, that makes sense. So fed first thing that I'm going to address is how to how to present yourself in the future to future people.

And then we'll circle back on what you might be able to do with this individual  lead.  In the future, if I'm setting an appointment I want to, before I let them go, I really want to clearly define so that there's no ambiguity or wonderment on their end, what it is that meeting is going to be all about.

A lot of times, I like to describe this in a really low pressure way. So I'll say something like  just so we're on the same page and know what our meeting is about. Basically what we're going to do is we're going to take a quick walk through the property. I'm going to probably make a list of several things that you could be doing.

And in what order you should be doing them.   I'll get an idea of what your potential value is. If and when you ever decided to sell. And and then I'll give you a couple of things that I could just take off of your plate. I'm not going to ask you to sign anything. I'm not going to try to pressure you into a sale.

It should be about a 30 minute appointment or just name the time. And and that at the end, you can decide if we should take it a step further. Now that person they know exactly what you're doing. They know that you're not there to give them a hard sales pitch. Now, when I do show up, I usually give them the option.

Of going ahead and signing something, say, just so you know, I every now and then I come out thinking that that somebody's not going to be ready to do business and they tell me that they're ready to list a house. So I did bring a letter of intent if at some point during our conversation, you want to just skip all the formalities and the discussion and the questions you just tell me, give me that thing and I'll, and we'll sign.

We'll get you listed.  But that's not what I'm here for. And so that's just one technique of a way to remove the pressure. Cause what she is saying to you is basically, I think you're coming out here to sell me on something and I don't want to be sold because she has one idea in mind and you have another, yeah, it's really hard to go backwards.

Sorry. I said, yeah, it was definitely strange because obviously with, during that call, I noticed she didn't have an attorney. So I focused the core of the the call that we had on. Do you need any, we're here to we try to reach out as soon as possible because we know that, the probate process can be  pretty extensive and complex and asked her if she had an attorney, she said no, and asked for some recommendations.

So I went ahead and asked her about that and has a vacant home insurance policy. Once she said she didn't have either of those and wanted some assistance with that. I said I'll have, attorney. Give you a call. She, she's worked with many families that have gone through the probate process.

They, they're very happy with her and then we'll have, for example Bruce Hill call you to discuss the home insurance policy. Obviously feel free to, to work with whomever you want, whoever you feel most comfortable with. And so then we set up that appointment and then I said, if anything changes, feel free to give me a call and we can take it from there.

So I thought I wasn't as pushy as I probably came off. So you were pushy. If what you just said is what you did then that doesn't come off as pushy, but it comes off as ambiguous. She didn't know what your meeting was about. And anytime that you have an unknown you're going to start to develop some suspicion out of those questions.

Okay. You didn't define clearly enough.  And you can correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds to me like you didn't define clearly enough what you were going to be meeting her about. Yeah, I think I should have clarified, like you said just to say, Hey, just so that there's no misunderstandings, I'm going to be coming over to do this, that with no obligation.

I just briefly stated I'd love to meet with you at the property so that we can understand and discuss what options are available to you. Whether, if for whatever you'd like to do, whether it's sell the property, keep the property or. Lease the property. So I gave her those three items just to make her understand that the option is yours.

But perhaps that's good with everything that we discussed. I should have, perhaps reclarify prior to hanging up. Yeah. I would have defined a time and a couple of agenda items. And in addition to what you gave okay. With those three options, I think those were perfect. She's still expecting you to come out and ask her to sign one on one of three different options.

And I know you, you, what you said was not full of pressure, and I don't want to propose that you don't ever want to put more pressure on someone. I'm just saying with this woman, I think that she was just had too many questions at the end of it and her mind started running and she started thinking I'm about to get a sales pitch and be asked to sign.

And I don't want to do that. Fair enough. That's fair. So what I did yesterday just cause I hadn't heard back from her, this the meeting will take place Saturday and she canceled on Saturday about an hour before.  So what I did is I sent her that letter as she asked and then yesterday I just followed up with a tech thing.

Hey, good morning. Were you able to speak with the insurance specialist or an insurance specialist of your choice to make sure that the asset is protected, it was just a way to stay in front of her.  So I'm just trying to, but obviously no answer there as well.  So I'm just trying to maybe, do you think I back off for a little bit and then touch base again, maybe in a week ish or so?

Maybe even few weeks unless she reaches out. Okay.  Yeah, I probably wouldn't let it go a few weeks, but I would touch base in a week I would lay off instead of going daily or every other day I might go with her.  Okay. There is a possibility that she's pumping the brakes because she has had a conversation with someone else.

So don't let it go a few weeks, but maybe a week. Okay. Okay. I'll do that. Yeah. I just mainly want it to keep you guys updated. Since I came out last week with, Hey, it's a win. It's an almost, when it still might be one, one, one thing I, one thing I was going to add fed is that buyer remorse is so common.

It really is. You're on the phone, you did a good job of closing them and then they hang up and say, Oh my God, what did I do? And. You remember the old Axiom, the best way to handle the objection is deal with it before it ever comes up. If you ever get somebody on the phone, if you get somebody on the phone and you sense that they're going to change their mind, you could even prep them, say something like, Hey, I really appreciate your confidence now.

You may wake up tomorrow morning and say, Oh my God, what did I do? Why is he coming over and, and want to cancel and just remember what I come over. There's no pressure. I'm just coming over to give you some options and it's okay if you're not ready to do anything. So pre if you pre-warn them, that they might have that feeling and how to react to it.

When it comes up, they may be a little less likely, to actually go through with canceling.  It just, and you might even want to leave a message like that now. I don't know what Bruce thinks. I'm not usually a fan of a lot of long voicemails, but you might want to leave a long voicemail.

Hey, when I was speaking to you, you sounded like you're ready to go. And I guess I must have pushed you too hard. I just want to call a remind you that there's no pressure when we get together, it's okay. Let me just show you what I can do. And I don't really expect you to sign anything, leave, let her off the hook.

So maybe she'll re-engage. Bruce. He added something to add. I love it. I love it. No, I was just  what you said. I'm not going to do that. I really appreciate that. I'll do that. I'll do that either today or tomorrow. Perfect. Thank you. Come back next week, come back next week and reshare the wind with us week.

It'll be a repeat with how's that. All right, buddy. All right, thank you. Bet. The next up is phone number ending in zero zero three three. You're up next.

Yeah. Are you there? Unmute us? Lakeesha it looks like it's Lakeesha zero, zero, three, three. Hit the unmute button in New York. Are you there? All right. Going, Lakeesha going. We're going to have to move on, but you have us muted out. So please hit star six and hit one and you can jump back in the queue.

Bruce, you can still hear me, correct? Yes, I can. Okay, good. I want to make sure it wasn't me. It was muted up. Lakeesha are you there? All right, let's move on. Next up is phone number ending in eight zero six six. You're up next? Yes. Can you hear me? Yes, thankfully we can. Excellent.

Marker [00:22:53] Hi my name is Beth I'm in New York.

And just a quick question about the posting for vacancies. So I was speaking with somebody about the insurance. They got that they were very appreciative and I said, listen, you want to make sure you don't get any spotters and we would recommend that you put some. Signs up just to notify that the, that you can't enter the property.

They thought that would be like a green light for somebody. If they saw that, that they would absolutely know the house was vacant and that would open them up to more, opportunity for theft and that sort of thing. And honestly, I struggled to have a good,  a good response to their concern.

So that's what I'm getting some feedback on from you guys. I'm gonna say, use that as an opportunity to build rapport. We are not legal counsel to these people. We're not coming through and saying, Hey, because I'm an attorney. I'm telling you, you need to do this. We're simply offering options and solutions.

And if somebody is not willing to accept or plays not just playing devil's advocate, it sounds to me like they were re rejecting the idea for themselves.  I've done my job. I provided a valuable option for them. And I'm just going to say, Hey, that's great. I've run into that a few times.

And I completely understand. I think I would probably put a no trespassing sign on my house  if I was in that scenario. But if you don't want to you're not going to get an argument from me.  Now, if you don't mind, if I ask you and then just go on to something else. Okay. I don't want to give you a rebuttal because a rebuttal, no matter how good it is, all it's going to prove to them is that you're a better argue or than they are, and it doesn't win you any points.

Okay. That makes perfect sense. Everybody has a different. Whatever. Yes, I get it. Thank you. Said because I totally, personally, I disagree with the premise because people  no soliciting, no trespassing. It doesn't mean somebody doesn't live there, but if that's their perception, I agree with Bruce.

You're not going to change their mind. And it's so I think you'll get that response may be one in a thousand times, that's a pretty unusual response to that. So that's a good, that's a great answer though. I agree. And it also shows  you're allowing them to be right too. People love to be right.

And you might even say, Hey, that's a great point. If you're not, completely, or that's an interesting way of looking at it, or however you however you want to phrase it, just acknowledge there. Like Bruce said, acknowledge their objection and validate it rather than, arguing with them.

That's a good one. Good way to handle it. Okay, perfect. Thank you so much. I appreciate it. All right. Thank you. We only have two, two more in the queue guys. So we got another, a half hour to go. So don't be shy. It started six at one, and jump in. We got plenty of the water's fine. Play a room for more. Next up is phone number ending in six, three eight, eight.

You're up next.

Hi, this is rod out in Arizona.

Hi, I got on the call just a couple minutes late and heard the tail end of that title set during probate thing. That's not what my question is about. I just want to say, I thought that was really interesting. And I want to hear more about that at some point.  Here's my question is I have been getting leads for one County.

Marker [00:26:04] I just recently ordered leads for a County near me that.  Only releases bleeds after probate is closed. How does the marketing to those leads change from normal marketing?

Jim, you got anything?  Are you, I suspect, are you in Colorado mic?  Ron and I'm in Arizona. There's at least one. You're you just said that your phone number said, Michael, sorry about that. Yeah, because we have that's a common question in Colorado, they delay the release of bleeds until the probate's completed.

So one of the counties, let me understand one of the counties that you've had, you're getting the probate data up front and the other one, you're not getting it until the probate's complete. Correct. There's two things you could do. You could do probate plus on that County and see in only market to the people that still have real estate, or you could just, when you are my guests in and you tell me when you're have you started calling these people, do you have a sense of what percentage of them are it?

Okay yeah, Mike, my guess is that, maybe. 30% of them, 30 to 25 to 40% of them probably are still going to be available and maybe a little more than half of them are going to be sold.   You may just want to start, you might want to put something use like our, we have a six month letter that we send out instead of an initial letter that says, Hey,  it's been six months since you filed the probate.

You may be sold by now, but if you're not the process has completed and this would be a great time to get the place on the market. You might want to modify your letter a little bit, and you also might want to modify your calls to say, Hey, I know in your market I just got your information.

It doesn't get filed to the probate's completed,  do you still have property to sell? You might just start off with that question. So you don't waste their time or yours. If you got probate, plus you would know that they still had property to sell. If you don't, you can accomplish the same thing on your first phone call.

Okay. Anything to add Bruce? Yeah. I think it's pro there's probably still more real estate in there than even what Jim just said.  I'm speculating every state.  Has a different speed of their process, but I just ran probate plus on a list of mine from a year ago. And there were still 50% of the of the leads still to this day have real estate a year later.

I think part of that is COVID, I'm just speculating, but. You're probably dealing with a lot of people that still have real estate. I think that COVID slowed it down a little bit.  I would go more direct. Normally if you're mailing someone or calling someone that just lost a loved one a month ago and they literally just started probate, you're going to be a lot more empathetic in the beginning on some of these leads where their family member may have.

Passed away a year ago. You have a little bit more latitude on getting straight to the point.  Let them know that you understand the experience that they're going through. So your letter might say, Hey, I realize it's been a little while and you might not have real estate anymore. And you might have done all this, but here are.

Two or three of the things that I can help with. And of course I also help with real estate sales either by purchase. I'm not right. I'm not a hundred percent sure if you're an agent or investor. And I'm pretty sure we've talked before both. Okay.  And if you are thinking about selling real estate  one of the biggest fears that I run into with people is that they just don't want to be taken advantage of.

And I promise I'm in it to benefit you first and feed my family. Second  call me at this number. And so you're just going a lot shorter with that letter and you can modify the our letters to cut them down. I'm just going to be more direct with people. Who've been through a six to 12 month probate process before I get their leads a lot more direct, tell them what I want, what I offer and leave some of that paragraph long empathy out, or at least cut it down a little bit.

Yeah. Okay. So just to add to what Bruce, add to what Bruce said, I agree with him. I was giving you my stats. And maybe Colorado's in my market. I work one to two year old leads and generally anywhere from 20 to 40% of them are still available. But a lot depends on us. What's that. Sorry.

He's he's Arizona. I know the County that he's in there, there's at least one or two counties in Arizona that, that delay their data as well. Yeah, no, I'm just saying that's a very, that's a very valid point that it does vary greatly from state to state.  I will tell you the nice thing though, is by the time the process has completed chances are, you got very little competition, and if they haven't done something.

By that point, they're probably more than ready to. And then you had a follow-up question run. Yeah. Basically it was what you're saying is I'll make a phone call and I say, or in the letter say here's some things that we can help with. And I understand people just don't want to be taken advantage of  we, our commitment is to you first and I feed my family second that basically the idea.

Yeah, it's one of the one of the areas that I go, especially if I'm going to use language about being taken advantage of  I'm typically going to tell them philosophically  who I look out for first. And if you're going to win one of the big things and this we're not going to play this right now, but this is a really big thing, a lot of our subscribers.

And so I'm going to use this as a quick opportunity to educate those who are prospecting probate.  A lot of times we err on the side of telling someone all the things that we're going to do for them without ever describing a single thing that we get in return or a single way that we benefit.

And and I run into day in and day out coaching folks that they're losing the trust of the lead that they're prospecting. And it's because we spend all this time saying I'm going to do this for you and this and this. And the person says, huh, how much do you make? And we go, I don't make anything.

That's a flat out lie. So if you're going to point out all the benefits that you're going to give someone  you might as well point out that you get a little bit of a benefit too. And I like to refer to that is how I put food on my table, how I feed my family, because everybody knows you've got to.

Feed your family or put food on your table. So when I reference my benefit, I don't talk about commission. I don't talk about fees. I talk about feeding my family or putting food on my table. So if you're going to talk about the benefit and the fact that you're not going to take advantage of them, you might as well also mentioned the fact that you're putting food on your table by helping them with real estate.

Okay. Okay. Very good. Thank you. All right, we appreciate it, sir. We only have one more person in the queue guys. So we got another 19 minutes. So we hop in there. Don't wait until three minutes of and get shut out, hit star six and hit one in the meantime. Next up is Mike phone number ending in 6,231? I think I was looking ahead to you, Mike.

Hey guys. How you doing? Good buddy. How about you? I got two questions. One is a really easy one. I'm going to be sending my first email out and to a person who I've not been able to reach who has not called me from my mailing yet. So  what's a good subject line that will get opened. Hey, Mike, can you make sure that your speaker or your mic is a little bit closer to your face?

Okay. I was able to hear you. So just in case you guys didn't yeah. I think it's a little bit better. You all hidden? Yeah. Much better. Okay.

Marker [00:33:33] Yeah. So my question was  what's a good subject line to send some to somebody who may or may not have received you a letter and you've never communicated with, but you have their email,

We haven't tested email, subject lines a lot.  But there's really two different ways of thinking about it. And Mike, you and I talked in the last week about different personality types and some personality types are going to respond to a copy of a professional copy written look, and some are going to respond better to a empathetic approach.

That sounds more natural. So I would probably do both  maybe not back to back in the same day or the same week, what I would go with something that's copywritten  three mistakes that three mistakes that most personal rent representatives make that adds stress.  That might be one.  Then another one that's a little bit more personal is I was wondering if I could help you with probate.

Okay.  Gosh Jim you can chime in here. I'm just thinking of, and to my mind we, and by the way, that is on our plate email products and helping you guys with that, it is on our plate, but it's months down the road. We're not ready to roll. It's something we are looking at.

And we've asked our agents to share with us before last time we talked about it and I thought this was interesting. Someone was using a technique that we have suggested that you use with the attorneys. That makes it look like official correspondence and just put regarding Arizona probate case number 87, four two three, five, six.

He said they were getting pretty good luck with that because it looked like an official, the call of a, of an email is to get it opened.  You're not trying to sell yourself. You may want, certainly if you're certainly, if you're prospecting attorneys, you want to do that. Cause it looks like a, an official correspondence.

But I dunno, it may not be a bad idea to try something like that with the executors too. And see if it. Makes them more inclined to open it and read it. And both of Bruce's ideas are good. Also, if you have some specific advice  or a pain point that you can address mistakes that people make could be,  not posting a trespassing sign, not getting bacon insurance.

And, I dunno, what's the third, most common one, Bruce, that people make.  Probate, quicksand getting stuck in probate quick, said there is a good one. There's a good one. Don't get stuck in probate. Quick said I like that. So yeah, I can tell this is something we haven't really tested. So I would maybe try all the above.

Yeah. Back to your point that you were making about the, regarding I was on that call as well, that week. And one of the things that they were also doing was. It's regarding the estate of citing the person's name. That is the decedent and or the PR. They got to open those emails. And that's the whole point is exactly that it is in fact  just to get them to open it and read it.

And if you put that in the subject line, they will open it. They will read it. If they're the PR. And they look at their email and most people who've been made a personal representative are that because they're a responsible person, they do have an email account. They do, work. It may not be, we give you more than one and hopefully the one that we're giving you is theirs.

And even if it's not, if it's a relative or if it's anything like that, As long as your message is one of offering assistance. You never want to lead with I want to buy, I want to list that's predatory. What you're looking for is to, basically exactly what Bruce said, make sure you're showing empathy.

And what you're looking for is I want to help you. I have things that I can help you with and they're without obligation. And you really need to think about the fact that. Your whole message. There needs to be one of straight and charity. And if there's gotta be genuine, you got to have value. You've got to have people at your disposal that can help them with, all of the common problems.

And the biggest one of those is if it's a house, it's a house that's still got the property of the decedent in it. And that's the hardest thing to deal with in most cases, unless in fact person is a hoarder and that's even harder, but it's still the property of the decedent. So those are the kinds of things that's a lead with, but I would not hesitate to do the regarding the estate of, and call the person out by name.

That's nothing going to get their attention more than that. That's good. I think that's a great idea. I wouldn't say that if I saw. I'd email. And I'm the personal representative with the subject line? I don't know if you mentioned this with their name on it, such as executor and then colon, then there's my name.

And then it's and then comma, regarding case, if I, my name is there as well as the probate case number and the decedent's name. I am definitely opening that I would definitely not be pressing to lead on that. Yep. And I think that the other thing that we said is also correct.

I think what you need to do is probably tested a little bit.  I've always, I'm always a fan of something that's simple because remember if you put all that in it and they're looking at it on their their mobile phones, they're not going to see a big, long subject line. They're going to see a few characters, look at it on your phone, see what and make sure that whatever you fit and you deliver it gets popped into that size.

The amount, that amount of characters, that's critical because I don't know about you, but today I use my phone probably to scan and determine if I really need to get at something until I'm at my desk. But 99% of everything I look at, I filter through my phone to start with more and more that's the case.

So keep it small, keep it short and to the point. Yup. Fantastic. Here's the last thing I'm going to give you? Michael, is. This is just general good technique and email. When you have a real estate business, especially if you're doing any kind of a drip sequence of emails.  You want to go ahead and a lot of those, and I might not do this on the regarding probate case this or regarding this probate case, but all the other emails you're sending, I would hyphen with your name at the end of the subject line on as many of those as possible.

I learned that years ago, I would prospect people that I'd been emailing and I'd call and I'd say my name and they'd say who. And I'd be like I know you've been opening my emails for the last year. Cause I'm tracking this. You've been opening my emails, but you don't know me. And that'll change the day that I started putting a hyphen with my name in the subject line.

And then I started calling people that I'd never spoken with before. And I'd mentioned my name and they'd go, yeah, I know who you are. So anytime you can get your name in the subject line without making it too long of a subject line it's going to. B, just a, another brand touch, even if they don't open the email.

Okay. So you would use your name rather than the hyphen and say the,  your town, family transitions, name or anything like that. You brought that up, your personal name from Michael Belden. If you're an established investor. I got to believe and I've experienced it.

People will research. Oh. And then you did not come to talk to me cause they just only think, Oh, there's this house buying guy.

Aye. Just looking. I think that ultimately we could guess their motives and what they're thinking all day long and some people you're going to be absolutely correct on, but any time that I give them a marketing or prospecting touch, I want them to hear my name because there's going to come a point when they need service.

And I want them to know my name. And so that's why I'm putting my personal name and email subject lines. That's why I'm putting my name and to voice messages. Anytime I can deliver my personal name, I'm going to do it because I need them to know who I am when they're ready. They might not know all my services.

They might not have opened my emails, but at least they've seen my name. Great. Great. And this is with, this is not with a subject line having to do with probate file number, correct? I probably wouldn't do it on that subject line. I would do it on more of the marketing, the general marketing related subject subject lines and those emails.

All right. Super. I remember one other thing you're talking about the probate file number. And you said that a couple of times, and  will say that in my opinion, The person's name for whom they are. The the executor is going to get their attention more than probate file name from terminology standpoint.

If they see Joe Bob Smith in an email subject line, and they know they're responsible for Joe Bob, that's going to jump off the page at them. And if you put the word probate, Joe, Bob Smith, somehow I'll get that into that short email subject line. It's going to get it open. That's fantastic.

All you guys are giving such fantastic genius ideas. I really appreciate it. And bursa,  you're speaking with you on those coaching calls is really valuable to me. So I want to thank you. Just one add added thing. Once you sky start upgrading the CRM or whatever you have a tab that says contact history.

There's. Th there should be some way you can select something that you're emailing them. So that would be also part of the contact history rather than the only way to mention you're emailing them is not through a dropdown, but through a, add a note thing. And of course you'd do that. And if you go to contact history, it will not come up.

As you're, when you, when is the last time you emailed them or something. So just an idea other than that. Thanks again, guys. I made a note of that. Thank you. That's great. Perfect. Thanks, Michael. Hi. I figured Jim's no one else was in the queue. I would jump in again. Sorry. Yeah please.


Marker [00:42:49]Yeah. All right. Great. So I'm in the process of ordering a brochure and some business cards, and I am an investor, but I'm also a licensed real estate agent. And I'm trying to figure out how to disclose that I am a real estate agent on the marketing materials, but in a way that it doesn't scream, that I'm a real estate agent.

So I put that at the at the bottom of any letter or brochure that I'm sending just in a footer section. I don't gray it out. I don't try to completely hide it, but I'm also not drawing attention to it.  And I do want you to know that occasionally I'm going to send a letter or a brochure or something where I am intentionally drawing attention to the fact that I'm a real estate agent.

But most of the time I'm not pushing that pushing that out to the front, front and center on the page. I'll just put it in the little footer at the bottom and I'll make it a slightly lighter shade of gray so that  so that they pay more attention to the message and the body of that brochure letter.

Okay. And then, because it's marketing material I should just follow my state's guidelines on what does that exactly required on it? Correct? Yes. Correct. Okay. Perfect. That's it. Thank you. All right. Perfect. Great timing guys. Last up his phone number ending in nine, nine, four two. You're up?

You're up last? Yeah.

Marker [00:44:12] Hi. I think it's a simple question, but I'd just like some advice. I see a lot of leads that you provide to me that it's either a husband or wife, friends passed away and the husband or wife is still living in the house. How do you address that? Sure.  And that's not, Bruce takes all the simple questions.

Go ahead, Bruce. Okay.

I don't want to step on your toes. We're supposed to have internal communications where we're not stepping on each other. I pay, so the husband, wife a lot I work with a lot of people who decide not to immediately pursue the surviving spouse. And I do believe that's a mistake  because. The spouse is very frequently still going to sell.

And we make the mistake of thinking that it's the spouse. That's making the surviving spouse. That's truly making the decision. If they're an elderly couple, a lot of times they have kids that are really driving that bus on what they're eventually going to do. So number one is we need to be calling all the numbers on the list.

That's okay. A no brainer. We tell you to do that anyway, but you really want to do it on their surviving spouses because you might be catching family members and children that are the ones that are putting pressure on a mom or dad to move to assisted living, to move in with some, so those houses are going to be sold.

They might take a little bit longer than your average probate test. Sell the real estate, but a lot of times they are. And I can tell you, because I work with you guys and I hear the number of people that don't call surviving spouses. I can tell you that your competition is bottomed out on surviving spouses.

Ultimately when you really get into a phone call like that, you want to describe the experience. And not push your services. So I'm usually going in and describing what what a lot of the surviving spouses are going through. I know that there's a lot of emotions that go into go into the process of probating an estate and figuring out who's going to get what I know that you're probably dealing with lawyers and banks and debts and insurances.

I know that. You're probably having to take care of this house that you had help with at one point by yourself.  And then you're just going to ask them, after you describe some basic experiences and don't quote what I just said make it your own. You're just going to ask someone if that.

Sounds synonymous or similar to their experience. That is where your conversation starts. It doesn't start around all the things that you want to come over to their house and show them how you can do. And they're probably not really wanting that yet. They just want to know and feel understood. So when you call them, make them feel understood by saying a lot of the people that I work with are going through this, and this, and that should kickstart the conversation and kickstart the relationship.

And if you find out that they're probably going to have to sell by all means set an appointment, but otherwise it's just a little bit of a longer nurturing relationship and they really do appreciate it. We call surviving spouses all the time and they're not angry. Yes, they're sad, but. We're not pushing ourselves as car salesman or sweet.

Let me say sleazy salespeople on that surviving spouse, we're really going in with a softer approach and describing some of the jobs that they have on their plate and asking them if it sounds familiar. Yep. And what I would add to that, I would put virtually a hundred percent of them in my serve influence.

And just check with them, every month or every few months, and just a friendly followup call. Hey, Hey Susie, we spoke a few months ago, I checked to see if you need any help. And I hope you don't mind. I'm just checking back to make sure everything's okay. Is there anything I can help you with just making them your serve influence?

Cause they are vast majority of the market to do something. And at the time they probably in denial.  If it's a single I don't, this is going to sound sexist, but if it's a single woman who her husband does a yard work and cleans the gutters and, does the, is used to the handyman role.

And my family that'd be my wife. So she's handier than I am, but one of the spouse spouses had a function that's lost now. And that surviving spouse may not realize that a month or two or three months later, but six months later, They start to realize that this big house is more than they need.

That's more than they can handle or want to handle. So even if they're, even if they aren't getting the pressure from the kids, which they normally are. A vast majority of them are going to come to that decision to sell. And you just want to have them like a past client in your sphere of influence.

So talk to them occasionally. I don't know, use your own judgment. If you think they're going to sell in a year, I'd call them every couple of three months. If you think they're going to sell in six months, I'd probably call them once a month and just do that followup call to see if anything's changed and just be real tread lightly, but be as helpful as possible.

Bruce said, Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Another call question quick, that came up while you were talking about this people with emails. Do you have email templates? Not yet coming attractions on me. Can we get traction? We are working on it, but yeah, no, we don't right now  we've asked a matter of fact, it's a good opportunity to ask again, if any of y'all are doing well with emails, please share with us because that's how we get some of our best ideas.

It's something that we haven't really worked on or tested yet. But if you have successful emails, something that's working for you and let us know, please. Okay. All right, sir. Thank you.  Another great call. That ends right on time.  Want to end this call? Like I always do. I want to thank each and every one of you for being here.

I want to particularly thank those who actively participated. I want to challenge each of you. Take one, thought one idea. One thing that inspired you on this call. Go out and put it into practice and come back next Thursday and share the results with the group. Have a great week guys, stay safe, stay productive, and we will talk to you.

Same time. Next Thursday. Take care of everybody.



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